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07 Jan 2025 14:27:28
Morning all!

Meslier, I've spent a lot of time mulling on what happened and watching lots of the media.

It does need handing well and carefully for a number of reasons, transfer value of the player, impact on promotion and financial prosperity of the club, managers credibility, unity of the team and the club and also the well being of the player himself.

Saying all of that up, I think he will leave in some way this window and we will bring on a new keeper on the justification of freed up wage and GK numbers and then let the three keepers ostensibly compete for the place. The only way I can see that not happening is if there is a real groundswell of support for him to have another chance from the key players, ie the rest of the defence. We all know the still photos of the immediate aftermath but what happened later and the next few days, that is key. If he has really lost all the defence around him then there is no other alternative. Pascal is important in this as he is a senior figure and personal friend of Meslier, and also subject to transfer rumour, so it will have quite an impact on him as well, particularly as he was missing from the game!

Let's see what happens!

Agree5 Disagree0

07 Jan 2025 14:52:45
Bueno sera Spanish ; good post ; I hope so re new gk coming in.

07 Jan 2025 17:01:11
Great to hear from you again Spanish, seems a very long time ago hope you’re good.

07 Jan 2025 17:08:57
For me you have to rule out sentimentality and stop worrying about the players feelings etc. Meslier is a millionaire, 30k per week contract paid to make routine saves and not make repetitive blunders that have so far this season cost us a minimum of 4 points but realistically his performances against Portsmouth and Preston were another 4 points blown and his virtual non command of the 6 yard box at corners is another contributing factor to the Blackburn equaliser and even the goal conceded at Millwall was a similar Meslier AWOL moment and I haven't even included his weak attempt at saving the Norwich penalty and the Burnley winner where for all these concessions you'd expect our rivals goalkeepers to keep those efforts out but no we are expected to accept Mesliers mistakes because of all the amazing match winning saves he made for Leeds?

I keep hearing Leeds fans use this line of defence in support of Meslier and I am scratching my head to remember more than 5 saves in 3 seasons that you'd say Meslier made a great save.

Away at Anfield when we won 2-1 a result in hindsight that stopped Marsch from being sacked and unfortunately sealed our fate.

Last season Meslier I remember his great save away at Leicester and at home to Norwich in the play off semi and this season I can only remember his 2 good saves against Boro so I just don't accept he has been an asset to the team and I'm just praying our owners intervene if Farke doesn't insist that we can not afford to excuse any more of Meslier's inexcusable goal keeping gaffs.

I can't believe anyone can still think Meslier should carry on for Leeds. are you a massechist? because it should be crystal clear bow he's simply not good enough and needs replacing immediately and his teammates must be pulling their hair out in complete exasperation over all the needlessly conceded goals that have seen our lead at the top cut to only one point when conceivably it should be double figures like Leicester had at this stage last season.

While I'm at it I've also changed my mind about Farke after his latest post match comments and the urter nonsense he spoke about missing Bamford etc so I would now replace him at the end of the season no matter what because even if we get promoted it's a waste of 12 games potentially seeing us struggle under his tactics and game management.

I would part ways and that way he will be seen in a sympathetic light get another great Championship job and he can concentrate on proving all his doubters like myself wrong and that he would be a successful Premier league boss. I just don't see it in a month of Sundays and if Klopp fancies a new challenge I'm sure Red Bull would let him take the reigns at Elland Road.

That's what I'd like to happen but whether it will. time will tell.

07 Jan 2025 17:58:02
Good to read you again Spanish - hope you are well mate.

The Mes issue is apparently causing rifts in the changing room at ER now with a number of players having been against him for a while including Rodon. SM pics of the reactions of the players toward Mes in the last game seem to confirm this so we may be getting toward an untenable position as far as Mes being Leeds no1 is concerned. Apparently the 9ers want a change and are actively looking for a replacement.

07 Jan 2025 19:36:06
Good to hear from you Spanish!

07 Jan 2025 19:49:15
Post of this season Cheshire White ?.

And Alf it definitely is ' untenable' position for Mes as Leeds number 1 and

will be equally untenable for Farkey if he stubbornly and foolishly continues to pick Meslier as Leeds United's Number 1 gk.

07 Jan 2025 20:20:27
Thanks guys,

I’m sure we’ll see a different keeper against Harrogate, that allows Darlow presumably the opportunity to make his case. If he has a solid game then easier to let him continue. But still wouldn’t surprise me if we get a new guy in and find a way of Meslier leaving.

07 Jan 2025 21:12:59
Good ? to see you Spaniard.

Remember when you post. It's your job to make sure the forum's readers are unscared! ?.

07 Jan 2025 21:14:08
Cheshire Fantastic post. I concur with Baz. Post of the season. Truly righteous. Well ? done ✅?.

07 Jan 2025 22:48:08
I’m not into today’s cancel culture whereby an individual makes a mistake then has no way back to redeem himself.
For me Meslier’s has everything to prove that people are wrong in their judgement of him.
Goalkeepers make mistakes from time to time.
I would say that Meslier is a victim of todays knee jerk hire and fire culture in football, sadly for this young keeper, the pressure from the fans baying for blood could see him out of professional football for good.
In my estimation that would be extremely harsh on this young man who does still have the potential to improve his abilities in the right situation.

My thoughts are to bring in another keeper of equal standing to Meslier and let them compete for that number one spot. Darlow and Cairns are so lowly ranked that it doesn’t invite any competition at all.

I know I stand virtually alone on this subject but I feel it would be a big mistake to reject and cancel Ilan Meslier from Leeds United and I’m pretty sure, like Bielsa, Farke still believes in his number one but he must find a way to take away or lessen this massive pressure that sits on him right now.

Good luck to him and I hope he finds a way to prove his qualities because he is still a Leeds United player.

07 Jan 2025 22:56:38
From my post on Meslier, if anyone would like to respond I would appreciate constructive criticisms please, no mud slinging and derogatory comments.
Thank you.

08 Jan 2025 00:44:59
OP "individual makes a mistake" but it's not a solitary error, is it? It's a pattern.

No-one is saying he should be sold or quit the game. It's simple. He was the number 1 GK, now due to his below par displays he's going to be number 2 or possibly even number 3 GK. It happens. No need for drama or referencing of "cancel culture".

It's called professional sport. Cancelation (albeit temporary) is what happens. It's called being "dropped" or "dropped to the bench". That's been a thing in the game for several decades.

If you're the opposition (which we are not so it placed Leeds fans in an unusual position) it unfortunately became a "comedy of errors". People have sadly been laughing at the misfortune.

Imo his employer is therefore duty bound to care for him by withdrawing him from firing line and in a compassionate and sensitive way.

It's no disgrace! He has had the guts to be a professional number 1 GK for awhile now. Would any of us honestly relish such a critiqued role played out in front of a national and international audience? I wouldn't!

During this rest from first team action, train him better, focus on basic stuff, rebuild him and his confidence and once he shows he's eliminated the whoopsy moments he can come back in.

I think you're looking at the situation through the wrong lens. His GK career has been a success, he's made good money, represented a historic football club in England, has pulled off some worldie saves, has played in the EPL and at Wembley! He's hit a ceiling for now but he can come back stronger, much stronger ?.

My sincere message is help the lad but do it in private (away from the spotlight) and also imo it was an error of judgment making him part of the leadership team in first place. Too much pressure too early and in such a highly important season. Sadly a mismanagement of the player and this is very probably what's been weighing him down. So why not lift the burden, encourage, coach and keep an eye on him.

Chance for Leeds United to keep on showing that they're a loving club.

Our outfield players especially back 4 can then raise their game during his absence and secure promotion for IM. Musketeer type philosophy which Mes should understand being French ??.

AIMO. Good luck Illan. ????.

08 Jan 2025 04:43:44
Or just sell him. It is very obvious he has got worse over the last two years. Maybe him and Farke aren’t on the same wavelength.

08 Jan 2025 10:15:19
I agree in part to your response that Meslier should take the bench, but to be replaced by who?
Where I disagree is with your view that he has not been cancelled, and not just cancelled but with a good dose of humiliation with it.
The, get rid now, give him away for nothing or even your own ridiculing statement of, Alan Partridge would do better!

I find in our country especially with its media, we all join in with not just a scathing attack on an individual in football but a unnecessary ridicule to rub their faces in it, Graham Taylor was a case in point.

Yes people are paid a lot of money in football but are they paid to be ridiculed?

Meslier’s is now in a position that no professional footballer would want to be in as he is now carrying a huge amount of pressure coming from the fans and the media, something that I imagine that any of us were in we would be paralyzed with fear and cack our pants literally.

Your assumption that no one wants to ruin him is false in my opinion as it’s already in motion. Same happened to Loris Karius who is now considering quitting football as no club will sign him, which is more to do with fan and media pressure than his ability as a professional goalkeeper.

I believe the criticism that has been vented on him has been over the top, with any other player if his performances are under par he would be benched and another player in that position gets his chance. Meslier’s has had no one to replace him, our second and third keepers are simply not good enough.
The club have not been fair with Meslier, giving such a young keeper far too much responsibility.
They should help him and not just toss him out, to have Darlow and Kiko before as replacements is pathetic in my opinion.

Sadly for Meslier right now I think the pressure might be too much but I still hope he finds the courage and strength to prove everyone wrong, and that’s with Leeds United.

As a footnote It’s not impossible to imagine for example that Man U or Arsenal buy him, starts afresh, works his socks off and becomes their number 1 keeper and a fantastic career there. It wouldn’t be the first time that’s happened either for a player who has been rejected from our club.

{Ed001's Note - Karius is struggling to find a team because his attitude stinks. After he messed up in the Champions League he didn't knuckle down and try to make up for it with hard work. Instead he spent that summer launching his LK1 brand. He has only himself to blame for his career going down the pan. He wasn't that good to start with and didn't put in the work.}

08 Jan 2025 10:26:24
Think George’s post is both balanced and fair.

For myself OP for a very long time I had imagined Ilans’ errors were solely down to confidence, as he was certainly not the young confident keeper we saw bursting on the scene at Arsenal.

Goalkeepers seem to be their at their best into their 30s so I also agree there is merit in not selling him but actually properly invest in a top quality (Spend properly here for once) goalkeeper who can truly inspire Illan to take his place.

I agree, no matter how badly he performs he’s still currently, previously, far and away the best keeper option in his time at the club, not his fault that sits with recruitment.

He was also shell shocked by the hammerings we endured under Bielsa in the EPL, however, conversely he’s now playing behind the best defence in the championship for limiting shots against him…. but still his stats on nearly every keeper criterion have him lower than 28th in the division.

When he shared the golden gloves award for most clean sheets last season with Palmer at Brom his personal stats were still bottom half of all keepers.

I also agree (when on his game) he can be good with the ball at his feet and he has previously shown a very good range of passing. He is also good in one on one situations and whilst unusual at times, has often prevented a goal.

However, I believe Illan has significant fundamental goalkeeping flaws, with regards to being incapable of managing his area whenever a ball is played into his area, he retreats backwards and is sometimes actually behind his goaline, this probably is exacerbated by our very strong central defenders whom he relies on to clear the danger.

His other basic flaw is around positioning, knowing where he is at all times in relation to his goal, this leads to seemingly weak efforts (often the oppositions first shot) consistently finding the net.

Could he eradicate these errors?

Possibly in time (but he’s played over 200 games for us) but it needs the right coach, right mentor, stronger competition.

But if we truly wish to be promoted this season we cannot hope he improves on the job. It would be similar to hoping Joseph finds enough goals to promote us, but without Piroe, James etc, goals we would not be top, we know after Hull our defence are losing faith in him.

Personally, I believe he needs a loan somewhere and truth be told I would not be upset he he were transferred irrespective of his transfer fee, I do not believe we’ve paid above a million for any goalkeeper for too long now, aside from Casilas wages and look how that worked out.

As George has highlighted however well intended Farke made things worse with his promotion to the leadership team, his insistence that he’s the best keeper in the division which simply heightens the response to such basic errors like in the Hull game.

I believe there are at least a dozen stronger keepers than Illan already playing in the Championship, even Kamminski at lowly Luton has far superior stats to Illan.

I will watch with interest what Farke does, my belief is he will try Darlow and based on his cup performance will decide from there, but I fully expect Farke to back Illan and for me, that will say more about Farke than Illan for there will undoubtedly be more errors to come if he does.

Nothing personal against the lad, he’s still only 24 and a millionaire, but I believe we deserve so much better than he can provide.

08 Jan 2025 11:34:45
Appreciate the feedback and measured criticism.
I’m not blind to see that there have been errors on his behalf but can’t help feel that those responsible for recruitment have seriously mishandled the development of a potentially very good up coming keeper. He should have been an understudy to a more experienced keeper of some quality.

I feel that he will be shunted out now but probably in the summer. Wouldn’t be surprised that a Arsenal, Chelsea or Man U taking him on as second keeper even though he has stated that he doesn’t want to be second keeper and they’ll probably guide him the way he should of been at our club.
This should have never happened and it’s very rare I will criticize the club but they totally f@@ked up the story of Ilan Meslier in my estimation.

Ed. Didn’t know about Karius’s lack of intent to as you say, knuckle down and work his way back. I guess he thought at his age he didn’t want to make the effort, which is no excuse in professional football and he can’t complain.

{Ed001's Note - that is why Liverpool suddenly rushed out and bought Alisson pretty much out of nowhere. Klopp was standing by him and then lost his rag over his attitude and went and replaced him. It was the best thing he could have done for Liverpool as he was nowhere near as good as Alisson was.}

08 Jan 2025 11:57:25
OP I accept the club has a concern about KD but thank your lucky stars the howler occurred in the beginning of January, not the end. To be replaced by whom? Go buy a new GK! You have a recruitment team. Put them to work! You'll find someone.

Humiliation? Yes, sadly and by millions but that's the nature of the beast. Act like Baldrick from Blackadder and British people will laugh hard. If our owners are unfamiliar and require an American reference, act like Hardy from Laurel and and people will laugh. What can you do about it? Absolutely nothing except take i'm out of firing line. What you can't do (which is what I think you prefer) is to prevent the reaction in first place. How you going to do that? You're talking about hundreds of millions of people!

You show me a way to change and prevent widespread fan and media humiliation once it's triggered and I'll show you a successful company that manufactures chocolate fireguards.

Focus on what you can control, not on what you can't.

Is it a shame? Of course.

Has his transfer value plummeted? Certainly.

Have his suitors shriveled? More than likely.

Is this problematic? You bet.

Is i'm feeling a touch down? Probably.

This is where top man management comes into place. Follow my sensitive steps suggestion. Time is needed. No quick fix.

Like many I have come across in marketing, they wish they could control the narrative (when it becomes disadvantageous) but you can't stop a natural reaction in a free market economy. You can't go back in time. You can't always cover up the truth.

Sooner you find a new number 1, you put a dent in the continuing humiliation narrative and begin to heal all round. I accept not easy and i'm probably not mentally equipped to handle it all. Your solution? Equip him! Perhaps the answer is time off watching British comedy shows so he can have a good laugh and use it eventually to stop making "faux pas" himself.

My brother Baz has my consultancy bill. Hope I helped and again I wish Illan well.

Lady George.

08 Jan 2025 12:04:35
Great posts Class and Georgey . and previously Cheshire. Outstanding fellas!

It boils my urine that with Mesliers many weaknesses and Leeds United recruitment negligence and weaknesses having been soooo evident for me and I am sure many others for multiple years and double digit transfer windows there has yet been any accountability!

Where on earth is the accountability for this cintunued Seven years of negligence?

Kinnear for starters whose been here throughout seven years!

Farkey, Marathe, Leeds Recruitment Dept too failed un 3 to 4 windows!

Yet we will just get doubling down and more gaslighting from Farkey and Kinnear especially!

08 Jan 2025 12:58:26
As Class stated it will be interesting how Farke will deal with this situation. Does he throw Meslier’s back in the lions den, which was a belief of Bielsa when Meslier had a bad spot. Or does he fold and give in to what the masses want him to do. ?
I wouldn’t be surprised if the pressure comes from the top to sway Farke’s decision.
Personally I still feel we will be promoted even with a confidence stricken Meslier but Farke will probably be forced to stick darlow between the sticks and hope for the best.
A very Leedsy way about certain things.

Lady George it may come to your surprise that I am not Angus Kinnear as you gleefully like to portray me, more of a Greg Kinnear if you like in my profession, but that’s the only information about my private life you’ll eek out of me.
Onwards and Upwards for the believers.

08 Jan 2025 16:46:00
Aha Greg Kinnear
So OP is a lurvee thespian. make believe stuff

Hmm makes sense.





 

 

 
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