19 Sep 2024 02:46:52
Carlos name the only one being mentioned.
Hope they have contingency plan cause no way he will come. Said no last year and now top of the table. Diddly squat chance.
Should be looking higher profile anyway. We should be able to tempt a good long term manager.
It's a stepping stone to the prem. With this squad a high profile manager should think to himself one season in champ and then prem football.
I don't know who. But we have a big carrot to dangle.
19 Sep 2024 03:17:15
Jose Mourinho. It's time.
19 Sep 2024 04:18:59
I really like Corbs. Think he's great. He's turned water in to wine and has done pretty exceptional things with a West Brom squad that should've been nowhere near a playoff place last season and nowhere near top of the league this season. Realistically, that squad is a mid table champo team under anyone else.
I also think his high adaptability also means, for my money, he'd be a much better suited EPL manager than champo. His versatility is a huge asset in that league and I think he'll end up there in the near future. Smart tactician.
19 Sep 2024 04:42:28
I’m not saying he is not a capable manager. I just don’t think he will come. To turn us down and stay at Brom makes me think the Leeds job scares him a bit.
19 Sep 2024 06:00:54
Don't think we're at that stage yet, but if we do get there then I'd hope he'd be open to it. Could do wonders with this squad.
19 Sep 2024 08:13:47
We’ve had long term managers in place, but our fans are fickle, and turn very quickly, forcing the board’s hand. That in itself is another factor to put prospective candidates off.
19 Sep 2024 11:23:42
Err reality check guys
1) Leeds United as things currently stand is no longer a particularly coveted job for good managers/ coaches.
. Marcelo Bielsa aside . Leeds have had bang average journeymen coaches for decades
2) Not sure our inexperienced ownership ( in football) is a draw for good managers/ coaches either
AIMO . but if the very successful in football and very experienced in football Red Bull Group were our owners
they far more likely would be able to recruit a higher standard of coach/ manager to Leeds United.
3. MOT . no chance on Mourinho. he has just started his new job in Turkey and is on eqivalent £ TEN million a year. our penny pinching ownership would run a mile. not that he would want to come to Leeds anyway.
4.Corberan? Didn't he already turn Leeds down anyway. I know Dill rates him . but he is a" nearly man coach" imo. he narrowly fails each time
Baggies will be fairly effective but still won't go up under Corberan.
19 Sep 2024 12:08:41
I got a feeling it’s closer than we think deal. In fact. If I’m honest. I got a squeaky after next defeat?
19 Sep 2024 12:08:57
Dill I meant.
19 Sep 2024 12:27:01
Feeling Aus?
OK so who is definitely lined up in your opinion.?
It would have to be someome not attached to a club who has agreed to join.
Simply can NOT have any repeat of that utter farce in 2023
when the panto hierachy of Orta and Radz spent SIX WEEKS very predictably folornly chasing unavailable coaches after sacking Brenty in February.
19 Sep 2024 13:43:03
The catastrophic mistake was bringing Marsch to the club, he was not in any shape or form good enough for the Premiership. The wheels truly came off as soon as he arrived at Elland rd. A marketing idea by Radz and Orta that went completely pear shaped.
We shouldn’t bye looking at any other manager other than Farke to get us to the Premiership, but it is a very valid question as to what Farke can do for us once there?
19 Sep 2024 14:10:55
I’m not a hirer or a firer baz. Not predicting who next. But if I was a betting man I’d say Farke goes next defeat within a month and Carlo is scared to take Leeds on.
Leave the hiring to mystic Meg.
I’m going on what I see as reality.
19 Sep 2024 14:13:56
Please. No yanks.
19 Sep 2024 14:20:03
Just a reminder
Who was it again that took all the kudos for Jesse?
Who was the man who "" studied "" Jesse?
19 Sep 2024 15:17:08
Aus.
Fwiw I feel Farke well may stay by default all season
as have a feeling Mr Marathe and Co can't get anyone to come who is better who is
1) available
And
2) wants to come to Leeds.
19 Sep 2024 15:18:06
Indeed Christopher
That would be you know who . who is inexplcably still rated by some on here.
19 Sep 2024 22:25:45
Why would you be concerned Baz if Farke stays all season, as you’ve already stated we will be Champions .
20 Sep 2024 00:30:56
If indeed Orta studied Marsch for any length of time it was almost certainly at the request of the money men, who liked the idea of bringing him in for marketing reasons. And guess what, Orta would have been studying any number of other managers at the same time (as indeed any Director of Football will be doing at any given time) , and possibly for a longer period. Some people seem to think that just because it was reported that he’d studied Marsch for a period of time that he was literally fixated on the idea of appointing him. Do you honestly believe other candidates were not approached and/ or interviewed?
Orta’s statement that Jesse was the logical next step after Bielsa was evidently not one he genuinely believed - if it had been, why bring in René Marić the former tactical analysis blogger who had previously successfully helped another former Red Bull Salzburg manager amend his tactics to become more effective in the German Bundesliga, and who was known to have been consulted by a number of top managers for tactical advice. It’s just a shame Marsch stubbornly doubled down on what he was already doing. Orta was the fall guy for what was a corporate decision.
Weird how some on here professed not to believe most of the stuff that was put out by the Club under Radz, but then absolutely believe what was said about Orta’s exit…. and indeed everything that was said about the background to Marsch’s appointment.
20 Sep 2024 03:45:42
OP
Firstly I was merely replying to Aus post suggestion above that Farke maybe about to be sacked ; I don't think Farke will be
Secondly I have predicted 1st place but its a nervous tentative 1st place with Farke as coach despite this seasons very mediocre standard ; wish we had better than Farke for it to be a given . but it is what it is!
20 Sep 2024 04:02:02
Clu .
Put Brenty and Maric ( who both knew each other well ) to one side . despite the fact that they won just 4 games in 22
Were the money men also making decisions for Orta to ridiculously spend six frigging weeks chasing the unattainable Slot and Iraola mid season Clu . or was that far . far more likely just DOF Orta?
and as for chuckle brother disaster compadre coach Javi Gracia that reeks of an Orta choice as does Big Sam. nowt to do with the " money men"
and lookey elsewhere at Sevilla Victor Orta in 12 months 2023/ 24 at Sevilla is on to his THIRD coach . TWO failed coaches sackings / mutual consent from Victor.
Plus we had TC and the Heck under VO . could go on
sigh.
20 Sep 2024 08:47:21
Baz - It may have escaped your notice, but I was specifically responding on the ‘charges’ against Orta on the appointment of Marsch. Where did I say, or have I ever said, that no criticisms of Orta are valid? And I’d be interested to know on what basis you claim Marsch and Marić knew each other well. You also can’t properly contend that between them they got 4 wins from 22 as Marsch evidently took no notice of any tactical advice from Marić, not modify his approach in any way, so the poor results are on Jesse.
Oh, and by the way, Kinnear has publicly admitted Big Sam was his choice, so you can stick that allegation where the sun don’t shine.
20 Sep 2024 13:35:50
Come off it Clu since when have you EVER posted a thread ( date please) criticising Victor Orta (or even in response to others threads) ? ? ?
And on Leeds United own official Website Brenty stated he and Maric knew each other well.
20 Sep 2024 15:23:19
No Clue, what's weird is the way you selectively include certain aspects of what Victor "" done "" and totally disregard others to suit what narrative your agreeing with .
Orta took the " kudos " for Jesse, because as Victor says HE WAS The FOOTBALL MAN, not the money man, the football man, his decision, and Radz alluded to that all along during his tenure
Victor done a hatchet job on this club, like Boro, like Sevilla, like wherever else he will go.
20 Sep 2024 15:39:31
What my bro Christopher said 100%;
20 Sep 2024 21:39:30
Baz, as you often do, you completely failed to respond to my querying of an assertion of yours.
I repeat, on what basis did you state that Marsch and Marić knew each other well.
I have on many occasions been critical of things Orta did. Contrary to your evident belief, I don’t actually have a pro-Orta agenda, just try to provide information which challenges other’s lazy assertions or blind acceptance of one sided reporting as fact. It’s far more interesting, and adds more colour to the discussion than boringly nodding along to the supposed accepted narrative. Isn’t that actually what this banter site is intended for - lively discussion of football, mainly focused on our Club - and not for trading personal insults, which happens with sadly too great a regularity. Wouldn’t it be dull if we just settled for group think - even on Orta.
Chris, yes Orta was the football man, as the Club was being run on too much of a shoestring to have a broader recruitment structure, and yes he should have pushed for a wider scouting network too, as there seemed to have been very little attempt to bring in talent from South America, for example, allowing the likes of Brighton to get a jump on us. He was the football man, but the football side wasn’t operating in a vacuum. Of course Radz alluded to Orta being the football guy, a great way to deflect blame for anything that could be so easily be pinned on Victor but which stemmed from corporate decision making - he knew Orta was disliked and distrusted for some of his interactions with fans etc, and it would have been very convenient to. play on that. Initially Kinnear tried to pin the loan fiasco solely on Orta, when fan anger was running at its hottest, but more recently, on The Square Ball and elsewhere, he’s admitted that it was a corporate decision, to make it easier to shift some of the high wage bill, while also protecting the PSR/ P&S position by not selling them at an immediate loss, which would have been an inevitable consequence as relegation would only have happened, and did so, if the squad had collectively underperformed, almost to a man.
I know it’s not convenient to accept that the truth is very rarely as black and white as it might seem, but that is just how it is. As I said, many on here stated that they didn’t trust the ‘chancer’ (or substitute what ever other insults you preferred to use for him) Radz or the ‘snake’ Kinnear, but yet, like you just now, are very keen to use something they said as evidence against someone they despised even more.
20 Sep 2024 22:33:29
Clu your shorter posts often far better, ironically carry more weight than your War and Peace length ones.
20 Sep 2024 22:44:35
Not sure if you are being deliberately obtuse Clu but I answered your query as I indeed always do ;
Leeds United website
30 July 2022 article
Rene Maric named Assistant Coach
Patagraph 7 of article and I quote ;
'Jesse Marsch said " I"ve known Rene for a number of years and we've stayed in contact for a long time now. While we haven't worked together before, we do know each other well and I believe he is the perfect fit to be my assistant head coach as out footballing philosophies are very similar. " '
Straight from the horses mouth Clu.
Not a ref flag in sight this time lmao ?
Cheers Clu . you're welcome ?.
20 Sep 2024 23:43:57
The key part Baz, is that they’d never worked together before. Of course they knew each other, as they’d worked on different parts of the Red Bull organisation for a number of years, probably met in a few corporate Red Bull think sessions, to hear from the great tactician Ralf Rangnick. And of course they stayed in contact as Marsch entered through the Salzburg doors as Marić and Rose left for Monchengladbach, and so they had a common interest - Marić had cut his professional coaching teeth in the Salzburg academy, so will have felt some attachment to the place, and a connection to those who’d worked there. The other key point is that Marić helped Rose to move away from rigid adherence to the Red Bull tactical playbook, and would have been well placed to do that given his experience of and indeed obsessive fascination with tactical analysis. Given the very evident shortcomings of Red Bull tactics in the Prem - as already shown by Hassenhutl at Southampton - there is absolutely no way such a tactics nerd as Marić would have bought into Marsch’s slavish adherence to Rangnick’s Red Bull nonsense, for all that Jesse tried to paint the two of them as kindred spirits. You will, I’m sure, recall that talking as if everyone was part of one big happy family, all pulling in the same direct and singing from the exactly the same hymn sheet was very much part of Jesse’s playbook, and the extended sound bite you quoted is a good example of that.
21 Sep 2024 00:21:34
And Baz, in case you missed or had forgotten Marić’s farewell tweet to Leeds fans - here’s a key section, ‘I’m sorry that I couldn’t contribute more and further as it wasn’t possible to instill some of the different ideas I envisioned for that great group of talented players that will surely be successful with others in the future. There is no doubt in my eyes. Hopefully the results will come already this week. ”
Tell me if you truly believe that isn’t an dig at the intransigence of Marsch and his lack of openness to the ideas René tried to put forward, and a truer indication of just how well (NOT! ) Jesse knew Marić and his footballing philosophy.
Cheers Baz, you’re very welcome.
21 Sep 2024 00:45:57
The other key part Clu is that Orta stated Maric was extensively interviewed by Orta and Marsch . with all sides able to ask and answer questions as to how Maric would improve Leeds and indeed how Marsch and Maric would work well together.
So if there was "no way "as you allege 'tactics nerd') would buy into Marsch's slavish adherence to Rangnick's Red Bull 'why on earth would
1) Maric not state his differences let alone agree to be Marsch 's assistant manager?
And even
2) Orta offer Maric the assistant manager job as you insinuate thst Maric did absolutely nowt for 1 year other than of course be very well paid?! a waste of money!
21 Sep 2024 02:28:28
so Clu therefore is Maric some sort of freeloader then Clu . picked up a years very big salary but did nowt as you say and he insinuates
classic Victor Orta wasting money again
professional outfit . not
Cheers Clu. you're more than welcome.
21 Sep 2024 08:09:55
Oh dear oh dear Baz. You can lead a horse to water but you can’t make it drink. That was evidently the case with Marsch, and it his refusal to drink the refreshing water of fresh tactical insight offered by Marić, and would seem to be the case with you.
Marić already had three years experience of working as assistant to Marco Rose another Red Bull manager in the German Bundesliga, helping to modify Red Bull tactics to become more effective in a top league. He now had the opportunity and challenge to work with another RB manager to make things work in the Prem, the best league in world football, at our Club which he will have know to have fanatical fans, rather like those at his previous club Borussia Dortmund - with a group of players he clearly rated. It’s more la case of why would he not have jumped at the opportunity. He might have hesitated if he had known Marsch as well as Jesse tried to suggest, and known of his tactical intransigence, but clearly he didn’t.
Why would Orta have offered him the job? - precisely because of his track record of helping to modify failing Red Bull tactics to be more competitive in a top league, and because Marić was known for being a tactical nerd, whom managers like Tuchel had turned to as a consultant for new tactical insights. Marić was working very hard while at Leeds trying to bring tactical sense into Jesse’s thinking. It only didn’t work because Marsch refused to let it. Had Jesse listened, we would very likely have been in the Prem now - which to my mind at least would have been money very well spent.
Of course Marić wasn’t a freeloader, he was desperate to make a difference, and if he was believed to be a freeloading waster, why would Bayern Munich, take him on last November to lead their coach development and playing philosophy team, and now appoint him assistant manager.
Baz, don’t be a Jesse, be open to different insights.
21 Sep 2024 10:45:40
Would be interesting to know what was actually said during evidently disingenuous interviews between all 3 of Orta, Marsch and Maric . and Maric himself is responsible with Orta and Marsch for unwisely accepting his doomed failure of an appointment
Orta has FAILED in his appointments of TC, the Heck, Marsch, his assistant Maric, Gracia and at Sevilla Alonso and Flores. their worst season in 24 seasons . well done VO ?
As so many ( well except you Clu ?) Orta is a wrecking ball of clubs. Boro, Leeds, Sevilla.
21 Sep 2024 13:38:49
Baz - do you honestly believe that Marić, who monetised a blog set up with another tactics nerd, and through it became a consultant to a number of well established and successful coaches, will have have made any disingenuous pretense to Marsch of being a dyed in the wool advocate for Rangnick’s Red Bull philosophy.
Maybe even Marsch convinced himself that it could work, to the extent that the others were given confidence that he was open to change, only to find that he was far more comfortable working with what he knew, and maybe he became irritated by the idea of a guy 18 years younger, who’d never played football professionally, telling him in effect that the tactics he had embraced and espoused as a coach for seven years weren’t good enough to succeed in a top league.
Human beings, like life as a whole, are complicated, and often unpredictable, even to themselves - not knowing how they’ll react to a situation they’ve not faced before, and with people they’ve not worked with before. But if you want to continue looking at thing in a black and white way, feel free to do so - it’s your loss.