Leeds banter 242822


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15 Jun 2024 05:26:13
Mateo Joseph could potentially miss the season opener ?

Joseph all but confirmed for the Spain Olympic squad. Games run from July 24th - August 9th. So should MJ and Spain get to the final, he'd be unable to be ready for the season opener on August 11th.

I get he has international aspirations, but my focus would be nailing down a first team spot for my club. Considering the position he's in, he has every right to challenge for that spot this coming season, so missing out on a large part of pre-season and potentially the opener doesn't make sense to me, personally.

Just hope he picks up no injuries and Spain flunk out before the final so he's available come EFL KO time.

Agree3 Disagree0

15 Jun 2024 06:14:03
Can’t blame him for wanting the experience tbf, but that is a key period to be missing from the squad! Don’t agree with football being in the olympics anyway, never did!

15 Jun 2024 08:01:05
Yh, perfectly acceptable to want to get that international experience as a young lad. Can't blame him for that. Just hope he thought about it long and hard, because he has a massive opportunity to become a starter this season.

15 Jun 2024 09:00:01
I am assuming Joseph would have sought permission to play in the tournament with Farkey.

Like most thought it was wrong not to give the Lad more minutes last season, whether it was the difference between automatic promotion and playoffs we will never know.

It’s a gruelling slog of a season in the championship but in reality playing competitively at international level is probably better than a run out at Harrogate in a preseason fixture.

So I’m happy for the lad if selected by Spain for a team that will have a huge talent pool to choose from, it should increase his confidence, sharpness, and of course player value.

Hoping he will have a stellar season for us next season and as Aus previously alluded to, bringing BA back into the team may be aligned to Matteo being our first choice number 9, I think he certainly deserves his chance.

15 Jun 2024 09:29:20
Wake up and smell the coffee fellas

1.DF showed very little faith in MJ last season nor gave him minutes to anywhere near suggest that MJ would all of sudden be DF first choice number 9 for this season! ?

Just with Cresswell it seems DF doesn't actually rate MJ that highly; squad player at best.

2) and even IF Matteo Joseph was somehow chosen as our main number 9 . that's a huge gamble to rely on an unproven rookie to get 16 to 20 goals minumum to get anywhere near top 2 placing

DF will be far more likely looking for another experienced proven first team CF say someone like Josh Sargent imo.

15 Jun 2024 10:42:09
MJ in my opinion is still a year or two away from starting regularly. Still a bit raw for me.
A talented finisher but his play has not got the intelligence needed to lead the line.
Any experience he can gain at Leeds or away with Spain will be invaluable.

15 Jun 2024 10:46:06
I don’t blame him for going, fantastic experience for the young man.
Does make you think that there maybe a new CF coming in?, can’t rely on Bamford with his injury issues for this campaign. Joseph will get his opportunities this coming season I’m sure of it.

15 Jun 2024 11:56:33
Baz, would you agree or not that, season to season, different players mature as a player and come into the fold and inevitably get more minutes and become starters? I mean we see it with every single club, every single season. There's tangible evidence that it ALWAYS happens.

Agree with it being somewhat a gambke, but I believe in taking risks in football with young players, otherwise hiw do you know if yhey aren't good enough if they're only getting appearance minutes ?‍♂️ when he's started he's played well and his progression has been evident since we first signed him. Tells me a lot about him and his character. Definitely worth taking what I'd consider a minimal risk. When you compound that with the other options we have available, I think he's in with a good chance of breaking through this season.

Having said that, I do agree and think we need to buy another CF. As OP mentions, can't rely on a perpetually injured Bamford.

Good points Class.

I think his overall CF play is already better than Piroe's, Ben. He offers a lot more off the ball in terms of pressing, movement and just pure energy. He'll be fine this season in rotation with a more experienced CF who isn't made of glass. That experience will pay dividends as the season goes on.

15 Jun 2024 12:27:42
Farke told him it doesn't make sense missing out on the Olympics because you'll be on the Leeds bench and I'll probably only give you 5 minutes if we are down 2 nil.

15 Jun 2024 12:58:44
Dill I wished MJ had been given far more game time last season especially when sick note PB went AWOL.

We would have seen / know/ have more idea/ how good MJ is/ could be.

What we do know is that DF does NOT take risks . so expect again for MJ to have very limited game time.

Baz guaranteed prediction :

Both MJ and CC will leave Leeds United permanently by next summer at the latest IF Daniel Farke is still Leeds United manager for 2025/ 26 season.

15 Jun 2024 15:19:21
Baz, I predict that DF will be Fired by Christmas. He will still play his favorites like (Bamford, Piroe) and continue to destroy our young Players. Hopefully he proves me wrong!

15 Jun 2024 15:45:24
Fwiw, I think Farke taking risks towards the start of the season is much more likely than towards the back end of the season. If MJ is going to get proper game time this season, we should know in the first month by how he is utilised.

15 Jun 2024 16:23:15
Destroying our young players is a bit OTT, Berm, given the likes of Gray, Rutter, Summerville, Gnonto played big roles this season while all 22 or under. Can't expect him to play young fringe players when there's better available to him, in the cases of Cressy, Joffy. MJ an outlier last season as he was the one who didn't get the game time he should have.

15 Jun 2024 16:35:47
Hooksie last season DF surprised me with his numerous weaknesses ( I genuinely expected him to be better )

Even though he had a cheat code plethora of QUALITY wingers and forwards for Champo he still wasnt good enough to get Leeds promoted

And the midfield recruitment was not good enough either

this season recruitment has to be spot on.

15 Jun 2024 16:38:55
Fair comment Dill re 1st month.

but last season Poveda and Joffy got 1st month game time . then afterwards virtually none at all.

15 Jun 2024 16:56:23
MJ put two past Chelsea on their home turf, while playing in a team a league below them.
How many strikers can say that?

DF is similar to Marsch in that he wouldn't play the younger players and refuses to use subs early, or at all. DF waiting til 80th minute, 1 down in a final and NOT using all the strikers was baffling.

MJ and Geldhardt need more pitch time. Same with James and (hopefully) Roberts.

15 Jun 2024 17:33:27
MoTagain . agreed re DF critique.

DF is vastly overrated by some on here such as Alf, OP .

15 Jun 2024 17:50:31

Dill, Like I said before If Archie wasn't a Gray he would have never been starting, Rutter had to start because of his salary, Summerville
earned his place and IMO Gnonto should have never been allowed to play again after wanting out and refusing to play.

Basically Joseph, Cresswell and Joffy have been vacationing on D Farke's Bench.


15 Jun 2024 19:16:29
So do you not think Gray is good enough then, Berm? Or the sole reason he's playing because of his name? couldn't disagree more. I'd go out on a limb and say he's good enough and has earned his spot, especially as the season progressed.

Rutter had to start because he's a game changer and our most dynamic and creative player when on form. Gnonto has been very useful this season. Off the field issues aside (which I also put down to his agent given what's been reported) .

Yes they have, but only one of which should be getting more regular game time and it's not the last two.

Baz, don't think either of those two were up to scratch. Neither were going to displace our current first team wingers.

When we're talking about young talent, we've got to be realistic and talk about whether they're actually good enough to make a difference or challenge/ displace the first team players. Joseph definitely can, so he has a leg up on the others mentioned.

15 Jun 2024 19:16:35
The fact that he won the Championship twice with Norwich means nothing then Baz?
Can’t in any shape or form understand how that can be overeating Farke as a very good coach in the Championship.
Winning the Championship for you should be an easy task to achieve I imagine!
More claptrap posts from you as usual.

15 Jun 2024 20:04:45
OP. Buendia and Pukki amongst others were the key rather than DF

Farke very overrated by you

. Martin has his number,

McKenna considerably outperformed hum with s far inferior group of players of ability

Farke failed last season .

16 Jun 2024 00:00:27
Dill, Archie gray has earned his spot in the team after a few games at the start of the season and I think he will be our best player this season. BUT, like I said before he would have never been given the chance at the start of the season if his last name was Smith or Joseph.
On Rutter, I don't recall anyone considering him a game changer during the relegation season!

Gnonto Refused to play not his agent. He flat out didn't want to wear a Leeds jersey like the other **** Bags that wanted and got out. Once again I'm talking FACTS!

16 Jun 2024 00:15:01
OP DF needs to introduce immediately the following:

1. Variation into his style of play.
2. Let the imminent recruitment reflect that. Nothing wrong going long or crosses into a box for a capable CF.
3. Rotation so key players receive rest and a recharge. No more gas out by start of April.

DF is capable but needs to implement the above for improvement.

16 Jun 2024 06:08:28
That’s why McKenna’s team had nothing when we beat them home and away, same goes for Leicester.
You can ignore, which you clearly do the difficulties Farke had to deal with a the beginning of last season.
When he did get the players playing the way he wanted we then clawed back the 17 points that they led by. He didn’t go changing his style of play to achieve that.
A good coach sticks to his methods and his winning formula and doesn’t go changing it every five minutes.

In my mind it was possibly inexperience with so many very young players that they lost their direction at the end of the season.

As for rotation who is to say on the form of players and how they fit in, are you on that training pitch seeing what goes on?
Example with MJ, like Bamford he probably wouldn’t have even touched the ball when we are playing teams that were deploying 10 defenders.

This constant Farke bashing is without substance it’s just a broken record to be perpetually whining .

{Ed001's Note - would you say Pep Guardiola is not a good coach then? Only he constantly refines his tactical approach from game to game. He has never stuck to the same methods, other than a broad overall strategy of wanting to have more possession than the opposition. The brand of football Citeh play now is nothing like the brand of football he first started out with at Barca.}

16 Jun 2024 06:43:40
Agreed OP!

16 Jun 2024 07:03:37
No I wouldn’t say every good coach sticks to his methods without changing, but I would say Pep Guardiola is an exception and does boast an incredible collection of world class players who can adapt seamlessly.
I look in the Chanpionship Ed last season and how Russell Martin of Southampton was questioned about his tactics at the beginning of the season. He didn’t allow any outside noise affect him sticking with his methods and it paid off.

{Ed001's Note - did it? They had a squad that should have strolled the Championship but his tactics almost put paid to it. I suppose you think Kompany did the right thing? His team were abysmal last season and it is astonishing that Bayern were so stupid as to hire him after that, but then they are a mess. Great coaches constantly adapt and innovate. Paisley won so much because he was always innovating in training and tactically. I would rather look at top level coaches than mediocre ones like Farke and Martin as examples personally. Perhaps you just want to be in the top 26 teams as Farke saw as his ambition for Norwich.}

16 Jun 2024 08:01:13
Vincent Kompany would go against my argument with Burnley last season and is a high risk for Bayern Munich.
Top level coaches do have better players to work with when tweaking their formations and tactics.
I don’t know what the aspirations of our owners are, but I’m sure they are more positive than Delia Smith was with Norwich where Farke had his hands tied with little to no budget in the Premiership.
This is all to say from this thread, I don’t know if Farke will be a good coach in the Premiership, maybe the Championship is his limit?, his spell at M’gladbach didn’t go with the expectations.

To back up your side Ed I would say Uni Emery did change tactics mid game to Villas advantage on several occasions last season and for me is a highly regarded coach.
I’m just judging coaching from more of a perspective in the Championship and how Farke deals with it and what his possible limitations are.

{Ed001's Note - ok mate, I was just pointing out that the best coaches of all time have always adapted and changed. Limited coaches stick with what they know regardless.}

16 Jun 2024 09:26:02
I agree with George. Some changes to DF's approach will only benefit us.

Berm, admittedly that may be my own personal opinion of Rutter having watched him at Hoffenheim, knowing what he was capable of. Although I'm sure he will have showed as much in training, hence earning his starting spot.

Gray is a generational talent for us. Don't think it would've mattered what his name was, he was making waves prior to this season and was bound to break through to the first team, although, yes, maybe expedited a little due to necessity.

Re; Gnonto, it's not that deep for me. Agent turned his head, it got resolved and sunsequently he's contributed well for the team. A goal involvement every 165mins played this season. Much better return that his first. Having said that, I don't mind if he moves on this summer if we get some decent money for him.

16 Jun 2024 09:29:24
Likely in the minority, but I actually think Kompany can get a tune out of Bayern. His EPL football at Burnley was hindered largely by players lack of experience and ability in relation to the other teams in the league. Neither of which he'll encounter at Bayern.

16 Jun 2024 10:02:54
No worries Ed, top coaches I’m sure adapt and change often when also they have European football competitions on their agenda.

{Ed001's Note - usually it is the players they have at their disposal that change it. Ancelotti was rigid in not wanting a number 10, right up until he took over a team with Zidane in it. Then he realised he had to change his thinking as Zidane was too good to not build around. While you don't have a Zidane, every team still needs to adapt to get the best players using their strengths.}

16 Jun 2024 17:46:59
OP Once a singular style of play is learned by the opposing team coach they adapt to counter. Variation is everything. Not necessarily at a high level (because those teams can just play their natural game too) but more at a mediocre level because those clubs realize they can't compete and have no realistic choice other than to play for a stalemate. At least half the clubs in the Championship fit this mould. No variation little success.

17 Jun 2024 15:01:05
Bob Paisley the great innovator? Not too sure on that one. Don’t think he was a tactical genius, more of a manager who had eleven captains on the pitch who all knew what had to be done by winning their individual battles. Brilliant manager he was though.

{Ed001's Note - you clearly know nothing about his tactics. I bet you think he only played 4-4-2, even though he rarely did so. It is strange because every other manager of the time will tell you that he was a tactical genius, but clearly you know more than them.}

17 Jun 2024 16:10:25
Paisley was a great manager as I have said. 4-4-1-1 was his most consistent formation and he liked ball playing centre half’s.
Former players such as Souness have stated Liverpool kept it simple and tactical decisions from Paisley were minimal. The eleven leaders should all be intelligent enough to read the games themselves then tactical coaching could be kept to a minimum.
Maybe you know more than his players?

{Ed001's Note - Souness was given minimal tactical instruction because he didn't need much. 4-4-1-1 was far from his most consistent formation. He also played 4-3-3, 4-5-1 and 4-4-2. He also came up with the system Dalglish used when he took over, as he was his advisor. He also varied each of those formations, used a false 9 on occasion too.

People, out of sheer ignorance, believe he mainly played 4-4-1-1 because Dalglish played off the striker most of the time. Except that he was often playing on the left side of a front 3, with Craig Johnston, for example on the right. Before Dalglish there was no 1-1 up top, so that is 3 years without using that system all on its own.

Former players also always say that training was mostly five-a-side, but it wasn't. There were lots of drills based on how Paisley wanted the team to play. That was how he got the tactics over, rather than through talking about them, as that is how he believed players learnt best.}

17 Jun 2024 18:32:22
Interesting reply mate.

{Ed001's Note - actually just noticed I made a mistake there - the sheer ignorance bit should have referred to the media, I never proof read what I typed as I was distracted. I was trying to say people are misled by lazy journalists who did match reports at the time. That carried on for a long time as they were trying to type up the copy as the match went on, so barely got to watch the game as they needed to get the report in so quickly.}

17 Jun 2024 22:39:13
Just read your reply again. Seems like you are calling me ignorant?
You seem to regard yourself as a Liverpool 70s expert? May I ask what year you were born as I have a feeling it was after the 1970s.
No need to get rude with a reply.

{Ed001's Note - no, that's why I was trying to clear that up, it did read that way when I read it again and it wasn't aimed at you. It was aimed at the general belief in print that Liverpool were set in stone the way they played, which stemmed from all the newspaper reports from the day.

As for the rest, I talk to people involved personally, experts and do research, not sure what age has to do with anything.}



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