13 Sep 2021 07:32:30
Not a rant but a question. Out of all the premiership clubs where would Phillips/ Rodrigo/ Dallas rank in midfield comparison? What about Roberts/ Dallas/ Phillips? Take out Phillips if injured. How many teams would that midfield dominate?
{Ed001's Note - and yet your midfield forced Liverpool to mostly get the ball forward quickly to the forwards to miss out the midfield as they were being closed down so well. But I do understand and it is a good point. Just odd that it was not really the midfield at fault, despite its obvious weakness other than Phillips.}
13 Sep 2021 07:58:45
Yes. We may have forced Liverpool to move the ball forward quickly but isn't that a bit of a negative way of looking at it. While we were doing that where was our forward momentum? This season so far we have been a bit on the back foot.
{Ed001's Note - it is not a negative or positive, just an observation of something you did well.}
13 Sep 2021 08:01:41
For me it was a distinct inability to pass the ball, too many missed placed passes, Liverpool did what we couldn’t, quick and accurate passing. We only had one good outfield player yesterday and that was Phillips. We did make one good quick counter attack in the first 5mins where Rodrigo should have scored.
Our passing accuracy has been by and large our weak spot with the likes of Ayling and one or two others who do give the ball away a little too often.
13 Sep 2021 08:49:45
I may be wrong, but we seem to be trying to force the play rather more this season so far, looking for a killer pass, or for a longer ball through the lines early on rather than building more carefully from the back. On to many occasions yesterday it seemed to be easy for a Liverpool defender to step just out and intercept a pass before it reached the intended recipient, who should perhaps have been less passive and moved towards the ball themselves. In such cases, the pass itself was accurate, just easily cut out.
I vaguely recall reading something during preseason suggesting that Bielsa was trying to change our patterns of play slightly, so that our opponents would have something new to think about. If that is the case, perhaps the players are taking time to adjust to it.
Also, on the left side, with Firpo having missed some games, he and Harrison probably haven’t had sufficient game time together to develop the more intuitive level of understanding Harrison had developed with Alioski while playing together for so long - which will unfortunately inevitably lead to more misplaced passes on that side. The same will probably apply for Dan James for a few games at least. I just hope that supporters will make some allowance for that fact and cut the new guys some slack, rather than getting on their backs about it and potentially scapegoating them if results take a while to improve.
13 Sep 2021 10:35:19
Without sounding repetitive, will some of the posters now admit that our 1st team squad is far far away from a proper unit.
A tranche of posters have been saying it for a fair while now that we needed serious improvement but others shout us down as moaners or always negative posters.
It's glaringly obvious where our frailties are yet Bubs seems to think piling the squad with wingers +wingbacks is somehow the answer .
Our bench is pathetic and if games were played till kingdom come Roberts won't (A) change them and (B) will also keep getting a game, why wasn't Summer window handled correctly? .
Wheres Forshaw now Andrea? The man with glass legs .
13 Sep 2021 10:55:21
Nobody has said our midfield doesn't need improving Chris what most have said is we don't want the club to spend an exorbitant amount and put us in debt and at risk of financial ruin again to buy what is needed to make us competitive with the top teams.
13 Sep 2021 11:01:47
Chris the deluded apologists/ hot tubbers / rose tinted brigade never will admit it ; I hope I am wrong but results and performances suggest otherwise so far.
13 Sep 2021 11:07:50
Liverpool players are among the best in the world and can pass the ball beautifully, accurately and quickly. They also close players down quickly and anticipate the game better which combined mean our players have to think and act more quickly which results in poorer balls. The quality throughout our team is still only high championship/ low premier at best so we will struggle against better teams unless those teams don't play to their ability. This is why I want to see continual strengthening in Windows rather than resting on our laurels. Very few of our squad have the capability to play at that level currently so o er time the majority need to improve or get replaced.
13 Sep 2021 11:37:25
Yes Canada there are people in this forum who said we are string enough as we stand.
As regards exorbitant prices, this is the store we now shop in and prudence can very quickly become desperation. You can't have all the income that the premier league provides whilst still trying to shop in LIDL .
Why hasn't the creative spark issue being addressed? Why hasn't another goal scorer being addressed? Yes we will gather a run of games soon and posters on here will say where have all the nay -sayers gone now?
How pathetic will that sound then? Because as we stand we are a very basic squad with threadbare back up .
Why does he refuse to blood the younger lads who must surely be scratching their heads after looking at Ty/ Rodi continually underperforming .
Gelhardt will probably leave soon enough and you just know others will follow
It just seems in crucial positions regardless of form certain players are never binned and that's a serious flaw of his.
13 Sep 2021 11:46:17
Spot on Chris again ; Canada used to talk sense.
13 Sep 2021 12:02:48
If we don't get pascals red card overturned who will bielsa play at centre half, Ayling, Dallas or one of our centre halves from the under 23's. You get he won't trust one of the young guys. Sooner try Roberts their wouldn't he?
13 Sep 2021 12:08:08
Alf, our players clearly do have the ability, that’s how we ended in 9th place and had such a great run at the end of last season which almost got us into Europe. But for that one poor run at Brighton, it would have done. We are certainly not well at the moment, but that doesn’t mean the players are suddenly not good enough.
Resting on our laurels would have meant not bringing anyone in over the summer. When he’s had time to settle into Bielsaball and develop a better understanding with Harrison, Firpo will show himself to be an upgrade on Alioski, so long as supporters don’t get on his back and scapegoat him in the meantime. Likewise, with James, in comparison with Costa and, when he gets his chance, Summerville rather than Poveda. Klaesson is also still learning the Bielsaball ropes, and his more assertive display with the U23s v West Ham this weekend suggested he is making progress in this and is likely to be an improvement on Casilla if called upon.
Clearly other players will be replaced each summer, and it is probably better to do this gradually. Other teams who have gone for wholesale changes on promotion have tended to struggle, and new players coming here have the added complication of adjusting to Bielsaball. We’ve seen how even a change of personnel on the left side has helped temporarily disrupt the fluency of our game. If we splashed the cash on large scale changes in the squad, this effect is likely to be greater, and longer lasting. We would also have beenin danger of undermining the spirit within the squad. I may be wrong, but that scenario would seem more likely to have led to a longer lasting downturn in results and increasing negativity and unrest at Elland Road, and we know how dangerous that can become for player morale, particularly if squad spirit has already gone - possibly leading to a relegation battle, having just mortgaged the future again.
13 Sep 2021 12:08:43
Sorry Chris but I don’t believe we have a rubbish squad. Look there’s always certain players that appear to us to not make the grade ie, Costa, Roberts and perhaps Rodrigo.
What Bielsa sees in a player is the potential, that doesn’t always come to the surface as in Costa, whether that’s a confidence deficiency or a technical. Sometimes players do need time to develop, Roberts in particular is one you feel has the potential but isn’t yet achieving it. How long do you wait before you say it’s not going to work is another question.
To say we didn’t invest well in the transfer window is nonsense. We bought two very good players in Firpo and James, the former will need some time to adapt to the Prem and Bielsa’s football and I’m certain Dan James will be an Elland rd sensation.
Bielsa generally likes players who can adapt in different positions if needed and wingers are an important part of his football strategy.
Everyone wants instant success, intolerance often overrides patience in being a football fan, be realistic we are not going to be an elite club full of superstars overnight. What we do have is very hard working team and a coach that will bring the very best out of them.
This team will come good and all this negativity will dissipate when we string 3 or 4 victories together.
It’s fine if certain fans truly believe we’re going to be in a relegation dogfight or finish mid table, you’re just not going to convince me is all.
13 Sep 2021 12:44:54
We overachieved last season due to 3 main factors:
1. The fixture list was very kind
2. The games were compressed which played into our hands as our fitness is generally among the best
3. A number of players had their best ever season.
I can't see these three combining again this season so we will likely do a lot worse.
Yes new players need to adjust which is why we should have done our business early so they could have a preseason.
We have known for 2 years we needed strengthening in Central midfield, hence the attempt to sign Cuisance and a number of enquiries for MF this year but we failed to land anyone suggesting the targets were unsuitable or there are issues with the terms we offer.
13 Sep 2021 13:20:43
Op, I never said rubbish I said basic, and that's what our squad is .
Again you speak of signings and the impact of.
My point is why has it not been in the 2 critical areas where it was definitely most needed?
Bamford for all his good isn't prolific enough to carry the can on his own .
I also said in my post yes, we will put a run together and that's going to create a attitude of (oh where are the moaners now? ) But that's not the reality of our squad as it stands, we will go through a few dips in form.
I am not silly enough to demand instant success OP but there's nothing going right at the minute and there's no spark from us . Hopefully Junior can find his feet quickly and provide support going forward and I also believe Dan will find his feet under bubs but again the goals or lack of is worrying.
13 Sep 2021 13:45:25
Alf - Firpo was brought in early, but an injury in one of the preseason games meant that he wasn’t able to take full advantage of that time, and integrating into Bielsaball was likely to take extend into the real games within the Prem anyway. Doubtless we enquired about James at the early stages too, indeed probably long before preseason, but were told he wasn’t available at that stage. Guess we knew they were targeting Sancho, and may also have suspected Ronaldo’s likely availability
would also interest them, and given Bielsa’s apparent obsession with James it was decided to wait for him rather than move for an alternative target.
13 Sep 2021 18:19:36
I hope a good number of you are not this negative in your personal lives, would be so sad to think I was disappointed that I actually woke up each day!
13 Sep 2021 20:13:32
Canada your post is a tad confused
I think you need to transpose your use of the word ' negative ' with :
' wanting better for Leeds United ( than Calamity Orta etc )
'fierce ambition to achieve more '
' realists of the current and future situation ' etc
'forewarning and problem solving of current and future potential problems'
Winners/ Champions are NEVER satisfied, they NEVER rest on their laurels.
13 Sep 2021 21:53:28
No Baz, you just see the worst in everything yet never offer a meaningful and realistic solution.
I'm bored of it and like I did last year when we had a bad spell and you lot kept repeating the same negative dross over and over again so nobody else could be heard, I'm taking a hiatus.
No doubt when we win a couple and normality returns I'll be back.
Have fun boys!
13 Sep 2021 22:30:23
Read you need real quality quality players in prem and where 4 or 5 short it's simple as that no good kidding your self's MOT everyone.
14 Sep 2021 00:03:38
Baz - you say your being realistic, and yet you applaud as “spot on†any comment which is negative - regardless of the realism or otherwise. To be fair Chris raises sensible points in a number of his posts but in the one you applauded above he seems to suggest that we have to accept that prices are exorbitant etc in the market we’re in. So we just go out and splash the cash, and to hell with the consequences?
Chris also asked Why didn’t we get another goal scorer? We did (Rodrigo) but unfortunately Bielsa rarely plays him as a striker, and how is Orta supposed to bring in yet another decent striker, if they can see that Rodrigo isn’t getting game time up top. Yes, Baz, we all get infuriated by some of Bielsa’s traits - but the more positive of us consider currently that his achievements to data to outweigh those concerns.
He also stated Bielsa refuses to blood the youngsters, and that Gelhardt will leave soon, followed by the others. Bielsa did blood some youngsters last year in the League Cup - that went well! - however he also, more judiciously gave some game time in the league. Yes I know some of them have left this summer, but on the whole the new young guns would not have expected to have been involved in their first year with us. Even you surely would not have thought to blood youngsters v Liverpool, Everton or that other team somewhere near the top of the league, or (talking about blood) against Dyche’s bunch of mixed martial artist thugs. Yes, Crewe seemed like an opportunity missed, but Bielsa was very clear that there were a significant number of first team members very much in need of more game time. He will have expected the players who started to have got at least a couple of goals within the first hour, and he would then be able to give minutes to some of the youngsters that. Unfortunately it did not pan out that way, he had instead to throw on Bamford and Klich to ensure we actually won. Yes he could have taken a chance and sent on the youngsters instead, which would have been great if they’d turned the game on our favour. But had we lost, that would not have helped the Club or the youngsters involved.
Hopefully opportunities will arise during the cup game against Fulham, and at various points during the season against the more suitable Prem opponents. The Club is very clear that they expect opportunities for Gelhardt, Greenwood, Summerville and Drameh to arise during this season - we are currently only five games in. Summerville and Gelhardt are already having their u23 minutes reduced, suggesting they may be closest to senior game time currently.
To summarise, some of your own comments, and many of the comments by others you choose to applaud as “spot on†seem to suggest you have a little to learn about reality before you can justifiably claim to be realistic.
14 Sep 2021 05:16:57
Clu a lot of U23s chat from you in that post but you unsurprisingly completely omitted to refer to the key points of
Orta not signing a CM nor a CAM
his waste of £65 million on JKA, Costa, Rodrigo,
his sicknote signings of Forshaw, llorente, Koch
need I go on . no . cheers.
14 Sep 2021 07:55:09
Clue I never for 1 minute will believe that Rodi was purchased with a no 9 role in mind
He won't get that role under bubs not withstanding a injury to paddy.
Clue In my eyes you are one of the posters even though I have a different view to yourself you also raise and deliver very valid points .
Canada wrote yesterday, do some of us complain about waking up each day .
That's such a childish comment . So he is now taking a break from this forum he says.
So using his logic once he encounters something else he doesn't agree with in life he just disappears is it 😂?
The forum works because there is opposing views on here, same as everyday life, we all don't / can't / don't want to agree with everything we all say
Anyways here's hoping we find out feet sooner than later and myself, Baz, Alf, Hess, Leo etc look like proper helmets 😂
.
14 Sep 2021 11:34:08
Baz you clearly don’t take account of what doesn’t fit your narrative. I didn’t omit to talk Costa, JKA and Rodrigo because I had nothing to say - it’s just that I’ve already said it so many times before. Bielsa actually specifically wanted both Costa and Rodrigo - which is presumably why he kept on giving Costa chances until James became available, and is doing the same with Rodrigo. We’ve been through JKA already, so I won’t repeat it all, suffice to say your first 3 red flags do not hold up to factual scrutiny and by extension neither do the other two. Yes, with hindsight the transfer turned out to be a mistake, but despite your continued belief, there were no red flags to suggest it would be a problem. If there had have been, why were that team on t’other side of Pennines keen to hijack our move for him.
It is you who has failed to address any of the facts I presented about JKAs minutes and form at the start of the season for which it as suggested he turned up seriously out of shape. You also failed to respond to the clear shortcomings I pointed out in Paratici, who you claimed had an excellent record as a DoF over many years etc etc. Whenever anyone presents information which does not support your rabidly anti-Orta narrative you fail to respond to it but rather double down on the points you repeat over and over again.
Chris - I was merely pointing out that we do have another striker - giving back up to Bamford - and that yes, I and doubtless many of the other positive minded folk, also get frustrated that Bielsa doesn’t use Rodrigo as a striker more often, as his first touch etc is better than Bamford’s - and equally frustrated that he keeps on experimenting with him at 10. Yes, it would have been preferable to bring in an experienced CAM and a backup striker instead of Rodrigo, but Bielsa believed Rodrigo could do both. Hopefully either the experiment bears fruit, or Bielsa brings an end to it soon, as he will not want it to cost us too many points. And yes, Baz, there is resale value in Rodrigo if it was decided to move him on. He’s still only 30 (31 by next summer) and actually a very good striker, for whom there will definitely be demand.
14 Sep 2021 11:52:55
So you think the club were right NOT to buy a CM clueless ?
dress it up with circumstance, shades of grey context, propoganda source material but the bottom line in business is that VO and MB have seriously wasted in excess of £100 million in player transfers that have either been a disaster or so far not worked.
i would rather have George than VO as DofF the guy is gash.
14 Sep 2021 20:29:17
Baz - as always you fail to address any shortcomings pointed out in your arguments, just keep on doubling down and getting more vitriolic in your abuse, of just about anyone who has helped steer our Club back from the wilderness.
Anything that disagrees with you is propaganda and any source material you rely on is apparently cold hard fact.
I thought you had said you’d rather have Paratici with his years of excellence - oh sorry, you don’t want to talk about him now.
On the CM, yes I would have liked one bringing in, but it would seem the Club are hoping our existing CMs can cover for now. Radz was rather foolish with his Forshaw tweet- would have been more sensible to refer to Shack, if anyone. Bielsa has only used Shack at RB so far this year, but has made it clear that he now also. considers him a reliable option in midfield. Shack has a good technique, is strong in the tackle and has a decent turn of pace, and bringing in another CM could actually have prevented his further development.