30 Oct 2019 09:09:48
We’ve gone down that road of trying different managers/ coaches, some unfathomably bad ie: Hockaday/ Milanic and the proven coaches as in McDermott, Warnock and Monk all winning promotion to the Premiership with their previous clubs. Yes they had lesser players in quality than we have now but so did Wilde, Wagner and Farke.
My point is that it is the “expectation†that has been our downfall. As we all know we have been out in the wilderness for a very long time now and as each season passes that expectation increases. I still believe it was that weight we carry that was the reason we folded inexplicably against Derby in the playoffs.
If we continue with this manager merry go round, we’ll be stuck in the Championship for another 20 years.
With Bielsa we are as close as we have ever been, I’m not really concerned that we stay within the playoff positions as it alleviates that extra pressure that comes with holding top position. I think Bielsa will have our team peeking after Xmas.
Once Costa understands and can implement what Bielsa wants from him it’s going to make a big difference to our results.
It’s very fine lines that can make all the difference, in my estimation this is ours.
No more manager changes Please!
30 Oct 2019 09:30:30
Wilde had a pooper squad based on what exactly?
30 Oct 2019 09:31:57
Totally agree OP. Enough with that chopping and changing rubbish! Stability please, with tweaks here and there in playing staff.
30 Oct 2019 09:32:18
Agree we need to stick with Bielsa - we aren’t going to get a better manager. What we need is to improve the playing squad.
30 Oct 2019 10:48:29
expectation was not our downfall. not being able to beat the lesser teams was our downfall. points agaisnt ipswich, qpr, wigan, brum, hull etc meant we would of walked this league last year. it was a huge flaw
as for saying we have walked the road of changing managers. that is nonsense we have changed managers but not changed to who our new manager might be therefore have not walked that road. to say if we change the manager we could be here for another 20 years is a guess based on sand. don't change the manager. tell that to villa it served them pretty well
you only stick with the manager if he can get the job done and that job must be promtion. so can he get us up. i don't think so and history proves one thing changing a manager can work for good or bad. we don't know how that will play out until a new manager came in.
30 Oct 2019 11:46:12
It will be out of our hands if we don't go up, Bielsa will be gone.
30 Oct 2019 11:52:05
With Berm. Alf, playing squad never been better. Only dead wood is Okane and Buoy. The rest are either mid Championship class, top Championship class or lower PL class. Name me one Leeds player not loaned out not the 2 exclusions I mentioned above who are actually lower championship class or worse?
30 Oct 2019 13:01:13
exactly George
many wax lyrical about phillips who is england class
plus I beleive more interntaionals than any other championship club
kiko from real doing well
eddie as gifted as any in this league
I mean come on how can this team not have promotion written all over it
bookies favorites. must be for a reason.
{Ed001's Note - they were bookies favourites because of Bielsa. Your team is full of internationals because of Bielsa. He took over a team you all thought was mid-table mediocrity, now you are deluded into believing he did nothing and it was all about having a great team because of the work he did.}
30 Oct 2019 13:50:38
Spot on ed001, i doubt if Eddie, Costa, White would be here if we still had Monk or Hok. Top teams are happy for us to have their players because of Bubs. Would KP and the rest be signing new contracts if they did not believe in what they were doing. Yes we can argue about who is played and whether the system would be better this way or that way. We are doing this because Bubs has made us into a top 3 team and we are scared of slipping backwards and its human nature to feel like that. Calling for the guy who got you to this position to be sacked when a lot is to be played for yet is a bit premature in my eyes. No i do not agree with all his decisions, no i do not blindly bow down to him, but unless you tell me Klopp or Mourinho are taking over i say leave well alone and see if it gets better.
{Ed001's Note - Real Betis did exactly the same with Quique Setien. They were challenging for the Champions League places with him, now they are battling relegation without him.}
30 Oct 2019 13:54:40
Ed001 I don't see that delusion. He did much, his contribution remarkable. However, to avoid lottery of playoffs and achieve automatic you need better results. Hence why I call for a more attacking formation at home. If Bielsa doesn't want to do that, in my opinion he'll underachieve. I don't fancy another season after this in the Championship.
{Ed001's Note - he is a great coach, not a miracle worker. You can only do so much with Championship-level resources. Injuries and suspensions will play a massive part, as you simply can't afford to build a squad to cope with missing players like a Prem team can. Berm keeps whining on about Colin, but he had a lot of luck with injuries, without that he comes nowhere as there is no back up and that is why the Championship is so hard to call. One injury can totally disrupt a season. Bielsa has had to cope with a squad that keeps losing players he wants to keep, but he is still keeping you in contention.}
30 Oct 2019 15:33:49
ed your wrong,
dallas, klich, douglas, alioski, BPF all internationals before MB joined. In fact I am sure he has not made any of our players internationals that wasnt already (apart from eddie who we got in but mb ain't done him any favours)
add to that Kp (who i don't rate but many do) pablo who was already a great, bamford who was decent at this level and I think you will find none of our players have fluished under Mb's coaching after an initial bounce which of course we did have.
we are bookies favs because we finished third and should of gone up. we can't throw away a league twice.
as for our players i think they are good player who underachieved with our last manager and then showed what they could do under MB however the wheels have come off (to a lesser amount) and Mb is unable to steer us back to a promotion he threw away
I think our sqaud is as good as any in this league and our results have been worse than they should of been because of belisa not us overacheieving due to him
maybe he is a great coach, got great ideas but he can't win games as well as many many other lesser coaches
if he is great why does he keep making the same mistakes and why does he hold the record for the worse throwing away of a championship league promotion in the history of the compition?
{Ed001's Note - no mate, it is not me who is wrong. You are just deluded. You finished 3rd because of Bielsa. Now you suddenly think you are better than you are.}
30 Oct 2019 16:12:35
Ed001 Agreed regarding injuries and suspensions. Definitely a significant factor why we failed last season. Agreed regarding loss of Roofe for this season but the replacements are excellent on paper, Nketiah and Costa. I simply see more value in playing a traditional style at home using Costa's pace and Eddie's undoubted finishing ability. Great coach, yes. Miracle worker, no but that's entirely my point. We shouldn't need one. There's no compulsory requirement to win the league using only Bielsaball. Why won't he adapt? Bielsa himself has said Costa would fair better in a different system. Bielsa also said recently that the 2 up front hasn't even been tested on the training ground yet. No Leeds fan, no neutral, no-one anywhere is going to reprimand Bielsa for going 4-4-2 at home or scold him further if we wins promotion that way. For me, his stubbornness is the issue and the only issue. Luck plays a part but he's not playing the percentages at home. It's no wonder we're involved in low scoring home games but our squad definitely suggests more goals are possible. I hope he adapts soon otherwise those fixtures against so-called poor opposition who set up to frustrate will see us squander more points when other teams are capitalizing.
{Ed001's Note - you are all getting so high off Nketiah because of performances in the under 23s. That is not proper competitive football. It is ok coming on against tired legs and putting in a shift but you all get so carried away as if that is not a factor.
Bielsaball works, why change it?}
30 Oct 2019 17:24:38
Ed001 I ain't getting high off U-23s. Weird you think I would. I'm getting high off Eddie's ability to find onion bag in a Leeds shirt.
{Ed001's Note - yes but like I said he is coming on against tired legs.}
30 Oct 2019 17:53:44
no ed
you said belisa has turned our players into internationals. wrong no player has been newly capped after belisa joined
he took over a team full of internationals, BPF, Pontus, Douglas, Dallas, Aliskio, Cooper, kilch maybe more i have missed, then pablo and KP and roof and than ain't a bad team is it. these players where all established internationals so that part of your statement was wrong no debate about it
i am not deluded i point out leeds flaws more than most i just don't think our team is any worse than other teams that have got promotion (cardiff, sheff utd, norwich) i think the difference is wilde and faluke turned barn door billy and the flop Pukki into top goal scorers belisa has turned bamford from average to can't score to save life
Belisaball might work but it don't work at this level and with the players. he has not got the best from any of our team other than maybe dallas and KP but then dallas is up for debate. many others are suffering under belisaball
Wildeball works, smithball works, flukball, warnockball, houtgtonball, wagnerball all works at this level
if belisaball worked we would not of been same old leeds falling apart again
look at isoltaed results (plently of them) millwall, charlton, hull, blackburn, qpr twice, wigan, ipswich, brum twice and the list goes all. all have far weaker teams than us yet all have beaten us
ok one off results happen but to keep losing to weaker teams is not a manager or style that works. it is a style that fails time and time again
you love liverpool imgaine if you lost to maybe 12-15 teams that where all bottom half of table and/ or relegated in the last season you would not be happy and saying klopp ball works would you
what part of any of that is deluded? I said one part of your statement was inccorect. it was. now what part of mine is dedluded. which is a very strong word
i acpect our sqaud isn't great but i do not accpect that under a world class coach this lot would not get promotion they would. so the coach ain't all he is cracked up to be.
{Ed001's Note - You think Bamford was some sort of goalscorer? He was crap, he had one season where he had a purple patch, other than that he was a joke. Pontus was sold, how is he relevant unless it is to prove that the squad is being weakened? Cooper made his Scotland debut this year, how is that not down to Bielsa then? And why is it you say it was not a bad team at all he took over when you spent the entire time before he arrived telling us, repeatedly, how crap it was?
Pukki was not turned into a top goalscorer by a manager, he was turned into one by being bombed out of a number of clubs due to coasting. So he started working harder and got a move to Norwich on the back of it.
No idea what Billy Paynter has to do with anything? If you are alluding to Billy Sharp then you clearly have no idea about football, he is one of the top goalscorers in EFL history.
One day you will realise why people who know the game talk about Bielsa as one of the greats. Sadly it will be when people like you hound him out of the club and you slip down the league. I give up bothering you have so much to say but so little of value amongst it all. It is just hot air and bluster repeated ad nauseam.
If Bielsaball doesn't work why weren't you relegated last season?}
30 Oct 2019 18:54:08
Totally agree Ed001.
You are now known as 'The voice of reason! 'ðŸ‘ðŸ»ðŸ˜‚.
30 Oct 2019 20:06:24
Ed001 Yes tired legs but he just strikes me as what I would call a "meat, potatoes, 2 veg" kind of a striker meaning he'll convert basic to half chances on the regular, i. e. the ones Paddy misses. Bielsaball works yes but better away than home where I call for a more direct approach.
30 Oct 2019 20:11:24
Ed001 is 100% right - Bielsa is a miracle worker getting our squad to where we currently are with the players that we have. Unless we strengthen in the playing dept. I don't believe anybody would be able to get a tune out of our current squad and certainly not get them anywhere near where Bielsa has. Superior fitness and tactics sees us winning games and drawing others that without that fitness and tactical acumen we would be losing them no question.
30 Oct 2019 21:03:43
@Berm. Alfie McCalmont got his international debut this year.
30 Oct 2019 21:29:47
pontus was to prove we had internationals (that one he fell out with)
sharpe i love but many on here slated him yet he is scoring in the prem now largely due to wilde
i agree pukki was made better due to work rate and the manager
bamford i said was average but belisa has made him useless, i believe this is he longest lenght without scoring?
if your arguement is if belisaball don't work why didn't we get relegated then i am not sure i can try to use logic
last year we lost promotion in record breaking fashion. that ain't great is it? a record. then in the playoffs another record
and you ignored my point about keep losing to lesser teams. that ain't great is it
he is a great coach. he has great ideals and when he come to the club we went up another level for six months. then we slipped and now he makes same mistakes and can't seem to turn it back around
great coach maybe. great manager not for me. managers get best from players and best results, best manager can adapt, pick best team, address problems all of which he just ain't done. a lot of problems have plagued him his entire career.
I think he is a great phylosipher of football, great on paper maybe not on grass. for me he is to football what stanisvalski is to acting great on paper but not on stage
ed. klopp is meant to be leaving soonish. would you have belisa? I like liverpool and wouldn't wish him on them.
{Ed001's Note - what are you wittering on about? Nothing you say makes sense. Klopp is not meant to be leaving and Bielsa was the other one I would have taken before Klopp. Philosopher? You talk such nonsense. You are so bloody ignorant it is embarrassing, Billy Sharp is not scoring due to Wilde, he is scoring because he is a good striker who was just unlucky to never get the chance sooner. Partly because of his own choices to stay where he was when opportunity knocked in the past.
I am done the broken record of ignorance is clueless about the game and just shouts louder until all others are drowned out. You will not be happy until you drive the best manager you have any hope of getting out of the club due to your blind ignorance.}
30 Oct 2019 21:30:44
brockley good point. and has he been getting in our team? no exactly so carlos got him his call up. if the interantional manager is picking him maybe he could replace kiclh who looks dead on feet at the moment.
{Ed001's Note - Do you not realise that international managers will take them because they are working for a great coach? No of course not, you would not know that because you would deny it even if the manager himself came and told you so. You would make up some nonsense about Sheff Utd fans telling you or some other attempt to justify your opinion.}
30 Oct 2019 22:02:21
You're so right Ed. I remember certain people before Bielsa's whining on repeatedly about how you couldn't turn sub standard players into promotion contenders, ring any bells to some people . Beilsa's comes along with not much investment takes us to 3rd. Certain people are then calling for his head continually as we are only 3rd and not looking like going up, in their not so humble opinion . ! You couldn't make it up . I detect mischief making at work, but I have long suspected this, hence why I try to stay away from the site . Well said Ed, at last some words of wisdom to the doom sayers and mischief makers . That's my humble opinion .
MOT.
30 Oct 2019 22:14:20
Welcome to our world Ed. Some people believe if they keep repeating and repeating the same stuff again and again then they must be right!
Most on here love what Bielsa has done and is doing for club and long may he continue.
Cooper Klich Dallas Phillips Roberts and Roofe and Jansson when they were here all improved immensely working under MB, not to mention the young lads coming through. And some folk would rather big Sam or Colin as manager. Unbelievable!
30 Oct 2019 22:30:17
Well said Raggity. Ed is bang on and most agree I believe.
Unfortunately a few faces have disappeared off here lately including Spanish Mick and Martyn said his goodbyes the other day. I don’t think I need to ask what you mean about mischief making.
30 Oct 2019 22:49:50
You are soooo right Ed001. Bielsa has over achieved not under achieved with a group of players who finished mid table 13tb. BW and George believe we have the best squad
Meanwhile Radz (and Orta) have been busy selling in tbe past 2 years the goals of Wood and Roofe plus Viera Jannson, Clarke, Taylor and many others.
30 Oct 2019 23:41:27
you a politican Ed you ignore my questions about losing to poor teams over and over and our record breaking fauliure? and twist other points
i never said sharpe was poor i backed him when at leeds, just saying manager like wilde got most from him same with pukki at norwich unlike bamford and belisa. that is my only point and it is a vaild one is it not. or you going to ignore that as well?
what is nonesense exactly? what is so ignorant it is embarassing be a bit more speciafic with your pointed comments please?
as for klopp i heard on football focus him and pep don't stay too long something about four year cycles and they don't believe a manager can stick about too long, klopp said something to this effect which was the segment of the show, not sure if true just repeating what i heard on football focus which ain't a bad source i would say
as for sheff i like them respect them just think wilde has done nothing short of a mircle. no one saw that squad and said promotion. and now they are holding own in prem. it is a good collection of players but under a great manager same with fualke and before that wagner
as for belisa. no i don't rate him. i respect him can see his good points and can see his faults. of which there are many
as for my nonsense ed we will see if he gets us up. i hope he will but don't think he has a cats chance in hell. time will tell how much nonsese that is. as for best manager you don't know that. we could get rid and get in our own dean smith or wilde couldn't we. he is decent but i don't think will get the job done and think out there somewhere is a man who would. for me that man is houghton who i have huge respect for
so keep you pointed ciritiscim till the time when i'm wrong and leeds are in prem until then have a bit of respect. i expect better from an ed to be honest.
{Ed001's Note - yes, yes, you stick to getting your knowledge off Football Focus, that will do it. It is not like it would take much research to find out Klopp has managed just 2 teams before Liverpool and spent 7 years at both, but a 4 year cycle it is.
Respect? You have shown nothing but disrespect to a man who has done things you only wish you could do and knows more than you can dream of about the game. If you showed some respect, you might be in a position to expect some.
What has Bielsa getting you up got to do with it? If you actually took the time to understand other's points, I wouldn't be on here now. No one is saying he has to get Leeds up, people are saying you only had a chance last season and are in with a shout this season because of Bielsa. If you mean Chris Hughton, then you need to check the money Brighton spent to win promotion or how expensive Villa's squad was. Chris Wilder was given time to build something, which you are not willing to give Bielsa because you have a personal dislike of him.
As for expecting better, I expect posters to show intelligence and wit and not be boring repetitive turds who bully every other poster into submission by constantly shouting the same stuff over and over and over. I guess we are both disappointed right now. I have asked you over and over to refrain from repeating the same stuff over and over, but you can't resist it. I would have expected better off a playwright to be honest....}
31 Oct 2019 00:49:29
Bahypocrite I believe we have the best squad in 17 years and the best manager in 18 years. However, what I see is his unwillingness or inability or both to adapt for home fixtures will turn a 1st or 2nd place in the league into a 5th or 6th. This makes me unhappy. Is my unhappiness unreasonable or unjustified to you?
31 Oct 2019 07:47:18
@George - I’m not sure it’s our best squad. I’d love to have seen what Bielsa would have done with Gradel, Snodgrass, McCormack, Becchio, Somma, Howson, Johnson, Clayton and Schmeichel.
@BW - re McCalmont. Your argument was that Bielsa was not developing players and the only internationals were internationals before Bielsa. You can’t then use the fact that there is a youth player developed by Bielsa, in the U23s that has been radically transformed by Bielsa and his team, and who has been given first team opportunities (and not done particularly well in them) as another example of Bielsa failing! You were wrong, he has dramatically improved the squad, including in your weird stat of how many internationals have been created (also Klich had been frozen out of the Polish squad for years, but only returned because of Bielsa) - but no doubt you’ll spin this.
31 Oct 2019 16:16:03
Cracking posts Ed! ðŸ»ðŸ»ðŸ»ðŸ‘ðŸ».
31 Oct 2019 18:54:21
George you rightly state above that Bielsa is the best Manager we have had in 18 years yet just weeks ago you had several posts calling for Bielsa Out?
31 Oct 2019 18:56:56
Challenge to George
How and why I am a 'hypocrite'
# good luck Georgey as no evidence or reason given by you at all till now.